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Author Topic: What is the "empty space" in an atom?  (Read 1924 times)
kuroman
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April 22, 2014, 03:40:14 PM
 #21



As for empty space
According to Quantum Mechanics and new theories, there is no such thing as empty as elementary practicals of matter and antimatter appears and instantly disappears in space but that's beyond what you need to know for now.


I believe too that is no such empty space. Before we believe that atom is the smallest particle until we discovered electrons and then quarks. I believe there is no end of it. There are always smaller things to discover as well as bigger things. Space is infinite, they call it universe but I call it multiverse. Space is just so vast that cannot see it all. Light is so slow, we will only discover this other verse once we discover a particle that moves a trillion times faster than light, but to discover this particle we must also need to detect/discover a particle a trillion times smaller than quarks.


String theory, I'll let you look that up Smiley, but it really depends on what you qualify, by empty, and inside the atom there are physical huge empty space (vacum) on the long scale of time, and very short scale of time it isn't the case

I'm pretty sure than one of the last Noble prices in physics, was given to a scientist who made a numerical simulation of the empty space state inside an atome or something like that, I don't recall the details since I've read that in a while and they didn't mention the alghorithm nor the limite conditions that were used
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April 22, 2014, 03:49:39 PM
 #22

An electron cloud is technically infinitely large, but of course it's more conveniently defined out to some sigma cutoff, which results in some shape for the cloud in 3d space.

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April 22, 2014, 04:40:28 PM
 #23

This "empty space" idea is a holdover from scattering experiments performed during the dawn of the 20th century. Most of the space in an atom is composed by the probability distribution of the electrons in the atom.

These experiments, if I am thinking of the same ones you are, more properly explain that most of the atom is "not the nucleus", not that most of the atom is "empty space". Of course, they still teach the Bohr model in schools, so it is no surprise that people get confused even after taking "some chemistry".

The atom is like a solar system. The nucleus is the sun and the electrons is the planets.

They are really quite different. Planets move in predictable, stable orbits around the sun, leaving lots of empty space between everything. Electrons move in probabalistic clouds filling all the space around the nucleus, leaving no empty space anywhere.

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April 22, 2014, 04:43:04 PM
 #24

This "empty space" idea is a holdover from scattering experiments performed during the dawn of the 20th century. Most of the space in an atom is composed by the probability distribution of the electrons in the atom.

These experiments, if I am thinking of the same ones you are, more properly explain that most of the atom is "not the nucleus", not that most of the atom is "empty space". Of course, they still teach the Bohr model in schools, so it is no surprise that people get confused even after taking "some chemistry".

The atom is like a solar system. The nucleus is the sun and the electrons is the planets.

right.  that's why it goes 2,8,8,16.  just like the sun and the universe

i am here.
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April 22, 2014, 05:14:43 PM
 #25

This "empty space" idea is a holdover from scattering experiments performed during the dawn of the 20th century. Most of the space in an atom is composed by the probability distribution of the electrons in the atom.

These experiments, if I am thinking of the same ones you are, more properly explain that most of the atom is "not the nucleus", not that most of the atom is "empty space". Of course, they still teach the Bohr model in schools, so it is no surprise that people get confused even after taking "some chemistry".

The atom is like a solar system. The nucleus is the sun and the electrons is the planets.

right.  that's why it goes 2,8,8,16.  just like the sun and the universe

You mean 2, 2, 6, 2, 6, 2, 10, 6?

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April 22, 2014, 05:38:18 PM
 #26

It's more complicated than that, The Atom model does not resemble planetary model at all or rather it's more complicated than that Sad, while the planetary model (Borh) explains very well the Energy Quanta (Plank)  it's a simplified model that doesn't represent reality Smiley It's like Newtonian Physics vs General relativity

Here is the progression of the atomic model

It's even more complex than that today with our current knowledge and new theories Smiley
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April 29, 2014, 09:13:34 AM
 #27

I'd very strongly recommend reading Lawrence Krauss' book "A Universe From Nothing". I'm part way through and the beginning alone is worth reading for a better understanding of what "empty" and "nothing" really means. Just remember that when things seem incomprehensible that means you are learning. The Universe doesn't exist for us to like the way it works, only for us to try and understand how it does.

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April 29, 2014, 11:19:47 AM
 #28

Consciousness.

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April 29, 2014, 01:20:35 PM
 #29

Consciousness.
Trolling again, are we Dank?

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April 29, 2014, 01:31:28 PM
 #30

Consciousness.
Trolling again, are we Dank?

Perhaps conscious/quantum energy does fabricate our universe.
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April 29, 2014, 01:37:15 PM
 #31

It's some kind of energy right?
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April 29, 2014, 01:38:49 PM
 #32

Consciousness.
Trolling again, are we Dank?

Perhaps conscious/quantum energy does fabricate our universe.
You're saying the consciousness is the same as quantum energy?

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April 29, 2014, 01:39:41 PM
 #33

Consciousness.
Trolling again, are we Dank?

Perhaps conscious/quantum energy does fabricate our universe.
You're saying the consciousness is the same as quantum energy?

How can one possibly think otherwise!? Grin
kuroman
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April 29, 2014, 01:55:43 PM
 #34

Consciousness.
Trolling again, are we Dank?

Perhaps conscious/quantum energy does fabricate our universe.
You're saying the consciousness is the same as quantum energy?
He is just trolling and what's quantum energy -.- ? also why conscious is related to humans in this case while everything even "empty space" if full of activity ?
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April 29, 2014, 02:07:27 PM
 #35

He is just trolling and what's quantum energy -.- ? also why conscious is related to humans in this case while everything even "empty space" if full of activity ?
This is the first time that I've heard about this too.
The only thing that I have found is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_energy_teleportation

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April 29, 2014, 02:50:14 PM
 #36

Dark matter

Could very well be dark matter.  Scientists believe dark matter exists (unexplained gravity in the universe) but no not where it comes from.

I'm into creating universes, smiting people, writing holy books and listening to Prayer Messages (PMs).
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April 29, 2014, 04:35:11 PM
 #37

He is just trolling and what's quantum energy -.- ? also why conscious is related to humans in this case while everything even "empty space" if full of activity ?
This is the first time that I've heard about this too.
The only thing that I have found is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_energy_teleportation

If you never heard of this, you can  type in youtube quantum physics and Consciousness.
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April 29, 2014, 05:08:02 PM
 #38

He is just trolling and what's quantum energy -.- ? also why conscious is related to humans in this case while everything even "empty space" if full of activity ?
This is the first time that I've heard about this too.
The only thing that I have found is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_energy_teleportation

If you never heard of this, you can  type in youtube quantum physics and Consciousness.
Google has no results for quantum energy.

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April 29, 2014, 05:50:36 PM
 #39

He is just trolling and what's quantum energy -.- ? also why conscious is related to humans in this case while everything even "empty space" if full of activity ?
This is the first time that I've heard about this too.
The only thing that I have found is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_energy_teleportation

If you never heard of this, you can  type in youtube quantum physics and Consciousness.
Google has no results for quantum energy.

It has but , try typing in youtube , this is complicated.
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April 29, 2014, 06:42:55 PM
 #40

He is just trolling and what's quantum energy -.- ? also why conscious is related to humans in this case while everything even "empty space" if full of activity ?
This is the first time that I've heard about this too.
The only thing that I have found is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_energy_teleportation

I know about the quantum energy fluctuation as one of the recent noble prizes was given to a scientist who made a numerical simulation of it and how Quarks appears in the peaks of those fluctuation (of course it's quantum mechanics so it's statistical, the peak has the highest % the rest less...)  but first time hearing about this theory (or rather as an independant thing, because Quarks and other subparticals appearing and disapearing is what they mean by teleportation? hmm I'll read more about it)
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